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Author Best Invert: Alpengeist, Montu, or Top Gun
therock
Posts: 127
Registered: 6/8/2005

Rank: Bronze Critic
7/6/2005 10:54:22 AM
In going through many of the coaster reviews on this site, I have noticed that when discussions arise about the best invert out there, Alpengeist, Top Gun, and Montu are all inevitably mentioned. I wanted to begin a discussion thread here for site users to voice their opinions on why they think either of these 3 three coasters should claim the title of World's Best Invert.

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To be the man, WHOOOO! You gotta beat the man.
Message updated 7/6/2005 10:55:13 AM by therock
CCTrack
Posts: 663
Registered: 6/10/2005

Rank: Gold Critic
7/6/2005 12:01:49 PM
Alpengeist.
larrygator
Posts: 4654
Registered: 11/7/2002

Rank: Platinum Critic
7/6/2005 12:27:46 PM
I've been on all 3: Top Gun
Hercules
Posts: 4037
Registered: 10/13/2004

Rank: Platinum Critic
7/6/2005 12:51:21 PM
Talon doesn't get enough respect.
Swimace
Posts: 5916
Registered: 8/28/2003

Rank: Platinum Critic
7/6/2005 1:33:36 PM
I've been on Montu, Great Bear, Alpengeist, and Dueling Dragons. My personal favorite is Montu- it delivers an intense ride with good theming and an excellent layout. Alpengeist was way too rough on the cobra roll to be a top invert, although its sheer size often brings it into discussion. I really like Dueling Dragons, especially Fire and I could easily argue in their favor for best invert, although I think Montu is just a bit ahead of them.
therock
Posts: 127
Registered: 6/8/2005

Rank: Bronze Critic
7/6/2005 3:27:02 PM
I wanted to get feedback from more experienced riders because the only one of the three that I have ridden is Alpengeist. I hear that the ride smoothness varies by setaing position. have any of you found this to be true? I only rode it once, and I was in the front row.
Message updated 7/7/2005 10:41:32 AM by therock
benleibo
Posts: 781
Registered: 6/25/2003

Rank: Gold Critic
7/6/2005 4:06:23 PM
Montu

What an amazing looper - maybe the world's best looping coaster. Golden tickets also gives Montu this distinction. It really is amazing - drops, speed, smooth, inversions, theming, ladnscaping, pacing - Montu has it all. Practically flawless. Dueling Dragons, Raptor, B:TR, and Volcano:TBC cannot compare. I will be riding Talon in two days but I don't think it will give Montu a run for its money. It is that good.
larrygator
Posts: 4654
Registered: 11/7/2002

Rank: Platinum Critic
7/6/2005 4:34:20 PM
Quote:
Hercules said:
Talon doesn't get enough respect.


I like Talon better than Alpengeist.

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Mom always said, "Don't play ball in the house".
larrygator
Posts: 4654
Registered: 11/7/2002

Rank: Platinum Critic
7/6/2005 4:35:57 PM
Quote:
therock said:
I wanted to get feedback from more experienced riders because the only one of the three that I have ridden is Alpengeist. I hear that th ride smoothness varies by setaing position. have any of you found this to be true? I only rode it once, and I was in the front row.


I found it extremely rough in the back row. But you are right, the front is very smooth.

I haven't encountered the ear boxing that I got in the back of Alpengeist on any other invert that is considered "Elite".

Message updated 7/6/2005 4:58:55 PM by larrygator
Danny
Posts: 6316
Registered: 5/23/2003

Rank: Platinum Critic
7/6/2005 5:15:33 PM
My rides on Alpengeist have all been AWESOME, especially at night. I haven't ridden Montu, Top Gun, or Talon, and DD is not as good as Alpengeist.
penguin22
Posts: 332
Registered: 2/14/2005

Rank: Silver Critic
7/6/2005 5:17:15 PM
I'll say Alpengeist. My second choice would be one that hasn't been said yet: Raptor.
tacoking
Posts: 9914
Registered: 2/19/2003

Rank: Platinum Critic
7/6/2005 8:12:24 PM
I hope you are talking about the Top Gun at Carowinds...

If not, it's Montu.

If so, it's Montu.

Here are how I ranl the B&M Inverts I have been on:

1. Montu
2. Top Gun: The Jet Coaster
3. Dueling Dragons: Fire
4. Dueling Dragons: Ice
5. Batman: The Ride
6. Raptor
benleibo
Posts: 781
Registered: 6/25/2003

Rank: Gold Critic
7/6/2005 8:45:43 PM
Quote:
penguin22 said:
I'll say Alpengeist. My second choice would be one that hasn't been said yet: Raptor.


Raptor is way overhyped! Seriously, it's one of the worst B+M's I've ridden. It's not a bad coaster and is certainly worth riding if you're there, but it's nowhere near the best invert. Not even close. It's inversions are not graceful and its a bit rough and jerky, especially the brakes at the end. The pacing is really off on Raptor. Montu is the best!

Out of the inverts that were not mentioned in the thread title I would say that Volcano:TBC is the best. Actually I think it's the only invert that gives Montu a run for its money. It's a little short, but intense, exciting, and adrenaline pumping. Very unique as well - one of a kind.

1)Montu
2)Volcano:TBC
3)Dueling Dragons - Fire
4)Dueling Dragons - Ice
5)Raptor
6)Batman:The Ride

And Vekoma inverts just suck. I'll be riding Talon in two days.

--------------------
"...for New York City, birthplace of the modern rollercoaster and the greatest city in the world."
-Robert Coker, Roller Coaster:A Thrill-Seeker's Guide to the Ultimate Scream Machines

Yeah NYC.
Message updated 7/6/2005 8:48:09 PM by benleibo
WAR2174
Posts: 1067
Registered: 3/6/2003

Rank: Platinum Critic
7/6/2005 9:41:32 PM
I think Top Gun is overhyped. It is fast sure, but it is too short. It is over before you know what happened. I honestly don't see how it is compared to Montu and Alpengeist. That being said, it is a good coaster. I haven't ridden a bad invert though. I wish I could get over to England and ride Nemesis. That looks like a good one too.
tacoking
Posts: 9914
Registered: 2/19/2003

Rank: Platinum Critic
7/6/2005 10:29:13 PM
Top Gun is only 13 seconds shorter than Montu. That's not short. I didn't think it was short.

Raptor is easily the most overrated ride, right ahead of Top Thrill Dragster. I like the rides interaction with the midway - but besides that it has nothing going for it.

While Montu is the best one I have been on, I think the best looking invert out there is Katun. That thing looks like a beast.
benleibo
Posts: 781
Registered: 6/25/2003

Rank: Gold Critic
7/6/2005 10:55:40 PM
I don't know. Katun does look very good - I mean how can a B+M invert of that size be bad? However, its layout looks a little bit too simple for me. I prefer Montu's sweeping, wide layout rather than a couple of inversions in one straight line with each other.

Now Nemesis look asbolutely insane. The only potential negative I see is its lenght - besides that Nemesis looks as intense and action-packed as they come.
larrygator
Posts: 4654
Registered: 11/7/2002

Rank: Platinum Critic
7/6/2005 11:07:27 PM
Quote:
WAR2174 said:
I think Top Gun is overhyped. It is fast sure, but it is too short. It is over before you know what happened. I honestly don't see how it is compared to Montu and Alpengeist.


I think hype and expectations have a lot to do with it. I didn't know much about TG:JC before riding it, but had only heard raves about Alpengeist and Montu. In the end I enjoyed TG:JC the best, maybe it is because of the expectations set for the other two rides.
tacoking
Posts: 9914
Registered: 2/19/2003

Rank: Platinum Critic
7/6/2005 11:11:51 PM
Nemesis does look intense, but the ride is only 1:20 long. Not even half the amount of time as Montu. I definatly think that will/would hurt it.
CCTrack
Posts: 663
Registered: 6/10/2005

Rank: Gold Critic
7/7/2005 9:46:19 AM
Quote:
penguin22 said:
I'll say Alpengeist. My second choice would be one that hasn't been said yet: Raptor.


Raptor is an awesome invert and is definetely in my top 10 in my top 10 list of the best coasters i have ever ridden.
therock
Posts: 127
Registered: 6/8/2005

Rank: Bronze Critic
7/7/2005 10:44:54 AM
Thanks for the feedback larrygator. I'm glad that I just so happened to pick the right seating by accident. Do you know if their is a physics-related reason why back seating roughness seems to be experienced most in the cobra roll? I am curious about this phenomenon. Thanks!
therock
Posts: 127
Registered: 6/8/2005

Rank: Bronze Critic
7/7/2005 10:50:01 AM
WOW! I am really surprise to see Batman: The Ride on these lists, ranked above Alpengeist. I have ridden both of them, and to me, Batman is a good quality ride with some intense elements, but it is not even in the same discussion with Alpengeist. If this were a boxing match, I think that Batman: The Ride would go scurrying into the safe haven of the locker rooms at the mere sight of Alpengeist. Just my opinion though.
larrygator
Posts: 4654
Registered: 11/7/2002

Rank: Platinum Critic
7/7/2005 11:11:46 AM
On a traditional lift hill, when you go down the hills you will always notice that you are suspended hanging over the top of the hill waiting for the back car the reach the top and gravity to take effect. This creates more speed for the back. Of course the effect is different on launch coasters.

In terms of the movement in the back consider a real whip. The part being held by the whipper does not really move much but its' slight quick movement makes the rest of the whip react violently. Same thing goes for a coaster train.
therock
Posts: 127
Registered: 6/8/2005

Rank: Bronze Critic
7/7/2005 12:03:51 PM
Katun! Wow! Thanks for the reminder. I had totally forgotten that I went to Mirabilandia a couple of times when visiting family in northern Italy. Now, I need to check their site and add their rides to my ride tracker. I will have to see a photo of Katun to remember whether or not I rode it, to provide more feedback.
Message updated 7/7/2005 12:23:22 PM by therock
therock
Posts: 127
Registered: 6/8/2005

Rank: Bronze Critic
7/7/2005 12:25:37 PM
Quote:
larrygator said:
On a traditional lift hill, when you go down the hills you will always notice that you are suspended hanging over the top of the hill waiting for the back car the reach the top and gravity to take effect. This creates more speed for the back. Of course the effect is different on launch coasters.

In terms of the movement in the back consider a real whip. The part being held by the whipper does not really move much but its' slight quick movement makes the rest of the whip react violently. Same thing goes for a coaster train.


Thanks larrygator! That was great information and your whip analogy totally makes sense. Do you know how some inverted coasters manage to minimize this whip effect better than others, to lessen headbanging?
Hercules
Posts: 4037
Registered: 10/13/2004

Rank: Platinum Critic
7/7/2005 1:29:30 PM
Quote:
therock said:
Katun! Wow! Thanks for the reminder. I had totally forgotten that I went to Mirabilandia a couple of times when visiting family in northern Italy. Now, I need to check their site and add their rides to my ride tracker. I will have to see a photo of Katun to remember whether or not I rode it, to provide more feedback.


Unfortunately, you can't add rides outside of the United States to your ride tracker I was going to study abroad in Italy this past semester, but things happened. I was really looking forward to Katun. Katun looks like it rocks Nemisis. Just my opinion though.

As for your headbanging question, I would think that a lot of it has to do with ride design and the way the elements flow. Also, the older (well, worst kept rides) rattle and get rougher. That can also be a factor in the long run.

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"I could never design another ride like Hercules." - Curtis Summers

larrygator
Posts: 4654
Registered: 11/7/2002

Rank: Platinum Critic
7/7/2005 2:47:18 PM
Alpengeist is the only B&M invert that bothered me in the back row, so I would have to say all other B&M inverts
Swimace
Posts: 5916
Registered: 8/28/2003

Rank: Platinum Critic
7/7/2005 8:01:03 PM
Quote:
larrygator said:
I found it extremely rough in the back row. But you are right, the front is very smooth.

I haven't encountered the ear boxing that I got in the back of Alpengeist on any other invert that is considered "Elite".


I found the front row rough too

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SheiKra- 2005's most amazing ride experience.
Danny
Posts: 6316
Registered: 5/23/2003

Rank: Platinum Critic
7/7/2005 8:32:13 PM
I rode in the front and back many times, and I didn't find any parts of the ride bad. I guess I just don't mind/notice the roughness
WAR2174
Posts: 1067
Registered: 3/6/2003

Rank: Platinum Critic
7/8/2005 9:26:45 PM
I just don't see how people find Alpengeist rough at all. It can't be that rough, I have seen senior citizens ride the thing because it is so smooth. But they won't ride Big Bad Wolf because it is too rough. Go figure.
RCGenius
Posts: 1180
Registered: 12/23/2004

Rank: Platinum Critic
7/10/2005 11:53:11 AM
The B&M inverts that I've ridden on so far were the Great Bear, Talon: the Grip of Fear, Montu, & Dueling Dragons Fire & Ice. In 2 weeks, I'll be at Cedar Point & will be adding the Raptor on my list of B&M inverts ridden too. Out of the 3 choices though, I've only been on Montu, so I'm going to have to go w/that. Montu has a great layout, a lot of speed throughout the course, inversions that're set at a very good pace, has a great 1st drop that's huge, & the Egyptian theming's unbelievable. It also has some great trenches & tunnels for the landscaping too. Alpengeist looks like a lot of fun though b/c of its sheer size, blistering speeds, & has great theming & landscaping & I'll probably be riding it sometime next yr. when I'll have my driver's license.
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